Poll

Do you think that Molyneux is a victim

Author Topic: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?  (Read 21379 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Kaz

  • Ideological Gadfly
  • FDR Wizard
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
  • "Dangerous Liaisons" by Rene Magritte
  • Respect: +154
Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« on: June 29, 2015, 05:56:51 AM »
0
Please qualify your answer with your thoughts.  Thank you.
Just because you have left FDR, it doesn't mean that FDR has left you.

"Taking responsibility for something and self-blame are horses of two entirely different colors. The former is empowering; the latter is paralyzing." ~ John Rosemond, Ph.D

Kaz

  • Ideological Gadfly
  • FDR Wizard
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
  • "Dangerous Liaisons" by Rene Magritte
  • Respect: +154
Just because you have left FDR, it doesn't mean that FDR has left you.

"Taking responsibility for something and self-blame are horses of two entirely different colors. The former is empowering; the latter is paralyzing." ~ John Rosemond, Ph.D

Mike_Lice

  • FDR Wizard
  • *****
  • Posts: 679
  • Respect: +318
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2015, 07:04:45 AM »
0
Please qualify your answer with your thoughts.  Thank you.

If everything is true what Stefan has told about his bad childhood then he is a victim of that.
But I don't fully understand what you mean with "is stefan a victim himself?".
Do you mean he is still a victim? If he is, then who do you propose is his current abuser?

Philosofree

  • Awkward Segway
  • FDR Enlightened
  • ***
  • Posts: 117
  • One does not simply call in and debate.
  • Respect: +27
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2015, 07:58:01 AM »
+1
He was a victim in his childhood (assuming what he's said about it is true). However, if we use Stef's own words against him, when he argues for free will and the importance of self-knowledge, he really has no excuse for his narcissistic/psychopathic behavior.
"In the long run we're all TruShibes."
so truth
much profound
wow

Kaz

  • Ideological Gadfly
  • FDR Wizard
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
  • "Dangerous Liaisons" by Rene Magritte
  • Respect: +154
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2015, 08:07:29 AM »
0
Please qualify your answer with your thoughts.  Thank you.

If everything is true what Stefan has told about his bad childhood then he is a victim of that.
But I don't fully understand what you mean with "is stefan a victim himself?".
Do you mean he is still a victim? If he is, then who do you propose is his current abuser?

Good questions.  The reason that I deliberately asked the question in such an ambiguous way is because that is exactly the way people do it when they describe themselves or another person "as a victim."

There is a great deal of freedom for the respondent in interpreting the question, so feel free to interpret the question however you want and share your thoughts.

Personally, I think that Molyneux was both victimised and abusive in the past and that currently, he lives a predatory lifestyle, but that doesn't make him immune from being victimised also.  I also think that he is currently being both fairly and unfairly blamed for things.

I know that I haven't totally answered your question atm Mike, as I would like to think about the topic a bit more before I continue posting.

edit: added last paragraph
« Last Edit: June 29, 2015, 08:16:42 AM by Kaz »
Just because you have left FDR, it doesn't mean that FDR has left you.

"Taking responsibility for something and self-blame are horses of two entirely different colors. The former is empowering; the latter is paralyzing." ~ John Rosemond, Ph.D

Jomyon

  • FDR Interested
  • *
  • Posts: 9
  • Respect: +3
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2015, 10:22:50 AM »
+1
Other. He's both a victim and a victimiser.

These two things are not mutually exclusive. He appears to be a victim of his mother and brother if that is true and he's a victimiser for obvious reasons. But there's a lot of unknowns which make the question difficult to answer.

Weston Dupree

  • FDR Enlightened
  • ***
  • Posts: 134
  • Respect: +63
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2015, 01:24:32 PM »
0
At first I believed that Molyneux was abused by his mother like he says. Then I saw that letter that Stef's brother wrote about him. I have no idea how it got on the internet, but it was interesting. I tend to believe the brother about Stef exaggerating his mother's abusiveness and it not being that bad. Probably, since Stef is so deceitful, it makes sense to side with the other person in a dispute.

Kaz

  • Ideological Gadfly
  • FDR Wizard
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
  • "Dangerous Liaisons" by Rene Magritte
  • Respect: +154
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #7 on: June 29, 2015, 02:02:46 PM »
0
At first I believed that Molyneux was abused by his mother like he says. Then I saw that letter that Stef's brother wrote about him. I have no idea how it got on the internet, but it was interesting. I tend to believe the brother about Stef exaggerating his mother's abusiveness and it not being that bad. Probably, since Stef is so deceitful, it makes sense to side with the other person in a dispute.

This post brings up the question:  Can one still be a victim if one believes one is, or does one have to be a victim by some external measure and if so, how would one go about recording it?

Just because you have left FDR, it doesn't mean that FDR has left you.

"Taking responsibility for something and self-blame are horses of two entirely different colors. The former is empowering; the latter is paralyzing." ~ John Rosemond, Ph.D

Weston Dupree

  • FDR Enlightened
  • ***
  • Posts: 134
  • Respect: +63
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2015, 02:05:15 PM »
0
Here's the letter that Stef posted on FDR.
https://board.freedomainradio.com/topic/8515-a-letter-about-me-from-my-brother-to-my-father/

Actually, His brother doesn't go in to much detail about countering Stef's claims about his mother's abusiveness. On second thought, I'm not really sure what to believe about Stef's supposed abusive childhood.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2015, 11:37:08 AM by QuestEon »

Kaz

  • Ideological Gadfly
  • FDR Wizard
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
  • "Dangerous Liaisons" by Rene Magritte
  • Respect: +154
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2015, 02:44:27 PM »
0
Here's the letter that Stef posted on FDR.
https://board.freedomainradio.com/topic/8515-a-letter-about-me-from-my-brother-to-my-father/

Actually, His brother doesn't go in to much detail about countering Stef's claims about his mother's abusiveness. On second thought, I'm not really sure what to believe about Stef's supposed abusive childhood.


I found the first point really telling (I know it is subjective ):

Quote
This is a game Stef
plays and he gets out of having to take any responsibility for himself or his
life – its simple when its everyone else’s fault.


He seems to be painting Stef as wearing the mask of a victim for personal gain.  It is well known how manipulative people from a "helpless" relative to the professional con-man use the "pity-play" to hook you in and keep you hooked.

One can also flip this around from the viewpoint of the victim: Perhaps he or she really was  victimised for real at one stage and s/he soon discovered how much s/he could get away with and was able to manipulate the people around him or her so s/he never had to leave the Garden of victimhood and instead of moving on, just got better at justifying his or her victimhood.  Thus stayed stuck.  A victim of being a victim so to speak.

edit: substituted growing up with moving on


« Last Edit: June 30, 2015, 11:38:41 AM by QuestEon »
Just because you have left FDR, it doesn't mean that FDR has left you.

"Taking responsibility for something and self-blame are horses of two entirely different colors. The former is empowering; the latter is paralyzing." ~ John Rosemond, Ph.D

Rafaman

  • FDR Enlightened
  • ***
  • Posts: 203
  • Respect: +220
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2015, 04:32:27 PM »
0
Here's the letter that Stef posted on FDR.
https://board.freedomainradio.com/topic/8515-a-letter-about-me-from-my-brother-to-my-father/

Actually, His brother doesn't go in to much detail about countering Stef's claims about his mother's abusiveness. On second thought, I'm not really sure what to believe about Stef's supposed abusive childhood.


Wow. The brother doesn't mix words. He is entirely dismissive of Stef and his "philosophy". He categorises it as a pity-scam and cheap attention whoring. Whats interesting is that in many old podcasts I recall Stef describing his abuse as the worst kind (e.g. Nearly being choked to death and starved like a POW). They are the most serious kinds of torture and if true, I find it hard that a brother could deny them. Perhaps Moly is, as we suspected, totally full of it. The brother says so.

I found it interesting that the letter refers to an identify change in stefan. The brother alludes that Moly seems to have heard of this power-through-victimhood and completely run with it. I wonder when that was? Perhaps when he went through Internal Family Systems therapy?

« Last Edit: June 30, 2015, 11:41:15 AM by QuestEon »

Rafaman

  • FDR Enlightened
  • ***
  • Posts: 203
  • Respect: +220
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2015, 04:49:50 PM »
+1
Victim of what is the real question?

I've long theorized that he's been victimized by the same kind of quack therapy he tries on his callers, realizing that everyone he says and does is always about him.  He's takes his perceived experiences and the "cures" he thinks worked for him then apply them to everyone else as a one-size-fits-all solution.

I tend to side with this argument. Yes, he's a victim but its more about what does with that knowledge. Assuming the abuse is true, Moly still has this extremist thinking. He can "solve" the worlds problems now and has the "answer", the only "answer". It's his narcissisic interpretation that irks me. In his therapy he seems to think that any self-discovery he made, means he is becoming more and more powerful almost invincible like a super hero. I recall one podcast he says "you go to therapy and come out with super powers". For most people its about learning to live with your weaknesses or overcoming tragedies. Its not that simple for Moly, nope, Moly supercededs that and became the world's saviour - all self-appointed might I add. That realisation is very disturbing to me.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2015, 03:00:41 AM by Rafaman »

Mike_Lice

  • FDR Wizard
  • *****
  • Posts: 679
  • Respect: +318
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #12 on: June 30, 2015, 02:25:10 AM »
0

Wow. The brother doesn't mix words. He is entirely dismissive of Stef and his "philosophy". He categorises it as a pity-scam and cheap attention whoring. Whats interesting is that in many old podcasts I recall Stef describing his abuse as the worst kind (e.g. Nearly being choked to death and starved like a POW). They are the most serious kinds of torture and if true, I find it hard that a brother could deny them. Perhaps Moly is, as we suspected, totally full of it. The brother says so.

I found it interesting that the letter refers to an identify change in stefan. The brother alludes that Moly seems to have heard of this power-through-victimhood and completely run with it. I wonder when that was? Perhaps when he went through Internal Family Systems therapy?

Going from my memory, Stefan told he got insomnia during the time he worked with his brother, this motivated him to see a therapist to deal with it. Stefan began to see the insomnia as a sign of a problem, his bad relationship with his family.
Stefan praised his therapist for helping him see this, but then again criticized her a bit for being new age. The therapist was applying Carl Jung's therapy techniques. Stefan after his therapy became critical of C. Jung. But he still thought the therapy was very decisive in his change and growth.

Stefan always recommends Miller and Brandon to people who wanna self-help themselves. Although  Stefan was changed by the work of Jung I don't recall Stefan recommending his audience to pick up something by Jung.

Mike_Lice

  • FDR Wizard
  • *****
  • Posts: 679
  • Respect: +318
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2015, 08:55:06 AM »
+2
@ dr Christ
The first quote is the letter by Stefan's brother and the 2nd quote is the comment Stefan wrote for the board members.

Quote
Quote
"Dad;
 
Consider your job
as a parent is to screw up your kids. The kids job is to get over
it!

After 7 years of
apologizing to Stef, I finally realize three things:

This is a game Stef
plays and he gets out of having to take any responsibility for himself or his
life – its simple when its everyone else’s fault.
It’s his loss – I had
a beautiful time with you in South Africa, I love seeing Mum and I’m proud you
are both my parents.
I will always see the
world as blue and Stef will always see it as green, I love him, but candidly I
think he’s full of shit and his philosophy of righteousness is boring, and at
this point more than a little pathetic.

Your time and
opinions are yours Dad, but I think it’s a disservice to the Stefan I used to
know who was powerful, loving and vibrant to indulge him as some sorry victim of
his past. It’s also a disservice to people that truly have suffered greatly,
such as victims of concentration camps, sexual abuse and other horrors, who are
able to forgive and move forward with love in their hearts.

Just my opinion and
not likely worth the paper it’s written on J!!

Love
[name]

Quote
Oops, forgot to block him in my MSN account!
Thought you'd all like to see that you never have to feel guilty for ditching bad people, and to never waste time waiting for them to change...[:(]"
« Last Edit: June 30, 2015, 09:46:56 AM by Mike_Lice »

Kaz

  • Ideological Gadfly
  • FDR Wizard
  • *****
  • Posts: 685
  • "Dangerous Liaisons" by Rene Magritte
  • Respect: +154
Re: Is Stefan Molyneux a victim himself?
« Reply #14 on: June 30, 2015, 10:56:56 PM »
0
Please qualify your answer with your thoughts.  Thank you.

If everything is true what Stefan has told about his bad childhood then he is a victim of that.
But I don't fully understand what you mean with "is stefan a victim himself?".
Do you mean he is still a victim? If he is, then who do you propose is his current abuser?

I changed my vote.  Yes he is a victim - a very successful victim.


 If he is, then who do you propose is his current abuser?


This is an excellent question.  It highlights what I was trying to explore in this thread, which is that one apparently does not need to identify a persecutor to be convincing as a victim.

« Last Edit: June 30, 2015, 11:15:39 PM by Kaz »
Just because you have left FDR, it doesn't mean that FDR has left you.

"Taking responsibility for something and self-blame are horses of two entirely different colors. The former is empowering; the latter is paralyzing." ~ John Rosemond, Ph.D