Author Topic: The Promise and Failure of UPB  (Read 8170 times)

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QuestEon

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The Promise and Failure of UPB
« on: July 16, 2010, 01:31:57 AM »
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The Promise and Failure of UPB (The Behind-the-Scenes Story)---This five-part series traces the history of Molyneux's Universally Preferable Behaviour: A Rational Proof of Secular Ethics from conception to reception...along with a few behind-the-scenes views.

Read the articles here:

Read the archive of previous comments on Liberating Minds here:  Liberating Minds--The Promise and Failure of UPB

And please...continue the discussion below!
« Last Edit: February 02, 2012, 12:30:10 AM by QuestEon »
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Technodancer

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Re: The Promise and Failure of UPB
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2012, 04:22:09 PM »
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As I've already said before to you personally, Q, I really love your stuff. I'm at part 2 right now and really start to appreciate this DonnywithanA - he did seem genuinely interested in understanding Stefan's philosophy, but as I suppose the majority of us (arguably all) at LM experienced - Molyneux despises criticism. Any criticism whatsoever, regardless how small, seem to be taken by Stefan as a punch at his ego.

It's fascinating to think of, really, what makes us the way we are, because it becomes more and more obvious that Stefan's childhood experiences have had a massive effect on who he have become.

Interesting too, of course, that someone you find so insightful and genuine at the beginning, can really show a completely new side the deeper you delve into his persona.

You seem to be quite good at keeping calm though, Q, is this because of amazing self-discipline, or are you just not that annoyed at Stefan's double standards?
"It's only after we've lost everything that we're free to do anything." - Tyler Durden

Patience

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Re: The Promise and Failure of UPB
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2012, 07:07:46 PM »
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Click on the following link to see the Liberating Minds archive of previous comments about this article:  Liberating Minds--The Promise and Failure of UPB

And please...continue the discussion below!

UPB may have failed, or failed to succeed as yet, but Molyneux is still promoting it at every opportunity, including an event in Vancouver this summer.  I'm sure he will have an adoring audience to hang on his every word.

QuestEon

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Re: The Promise and Failure of UPB
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2012, 12:45:21 AM »
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UPB may have failed, or failed to succeed as yet, but Molyneux is still promoting it at every opportunity, including an event in Vancouver this summer.  I'm sure he will have an adoring audience to hang on his every word.


Hmm...seems like at least one member of his audience isn't quite so charmed;)
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QuestEon

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Re: The Promise and Failure of UPB
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2012, 01:27:11 AM »
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As I've already said before to you personally, Q, I really love your stuff.

I really do appreciate it. Thank you very much!

Quote
I'm at part 2 right now and really start to appreciate this DonnywithanA - he did seem genuinely interested in understanding Stefan's philosophy, but as I suppose the majority of us (arguably all) at LM experienced - Molyneux despises criticism. Any criticism whatsoever, regardless how small, seem to be taken by Stefan as a punch at his ego.

Danny is one of those people who is a joy to talk to--brilliant and humble. I learned a lot from him. He posted for a little while on LiMi. It would be an unexpected treat if ever shows up here.

That entire UPB episode must have been agonizing for Molyneux. Each polite question from Danny was yet another cordial drop of acid on Molyneux's masterwork. No wonder he raged behind the scenes.

Quote
Interesting too, of course, that someone you find so insightful and genuine at the beginning, can really show a completely new side the deeper you delve into his persona.

Molyneux is a very practiced salesman, especially when it comes to selling you a particular image of himself. I wrote about his persuasiveness here: (The Three Persuasions of Stefan Molyneux). It's pretty long, though.  :-[

Quote
You seem to be quite good at keeping calm though, Q, is this because of amazing self-discipline, or are you just not that annoyed at Stefan's double standards?

  • It's another thing you can thank Danny for. I copied his approach.
  • I had two ways to go with my site: (1) Try to tell everybody what to think or (2) Calmly present reason and evidence and know they can think for themselves. I chose (2).
  • If you make a case or criticism with emotion, Molyneux pounces on that as a reason to invalidate you.
  • To be honest with you, the subject of my site isn't really Molyneux, it's always been "me trying to be a better writer." He's just my subject.
  • It's easy for me to stay calm because I don't have any skin in the game, having never been an FDR member. I empathize with those who have been impacted but that's all.
  • Calmly presenting irrefutable evidence enrages Molyneux more than you can imagine.
It may be one, several, or all of those.  ;)
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LeafInTheStream

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Re: The Promise and Failure of UPB
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2014, 11:28:39 AM »
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Dear QuestEon,

As a Canadian I take strong exception to the above article.  Gordon Lightfoot is very much alive!  A correction would be very much appreciated.  Thanks.

QuestEon

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Re: The Promise and Failure of UPB
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2014, 12:45:07 PM »
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Dear QuestEon,

As a Canadian I take strong exception to the above article.  Gordon Lightfoot is very much alive!  A correction would be very much appreciated.  Thanks.

"Oh my God, They killed Gordon!"
"You bastards!"

Sorry about that, I have resurrected poor Gordon. Let his voice sing once more.  :)
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starmancer

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Re: The Promise and Failure of UPB
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2014, 09:40:47 PM »
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Great work, I'm new to this site and I'm extremely thankful for what you're doing here. I appreciate Molyneux's work at spreading libertarianism and he's a good explainer of other people's work, but his own podcasts always struck me as needlessly verbose, and morally unsettling, but I lack the time and energy to go through all that material solo to figure out just what this guy is up to.

I'm glad someone is out there digging through the crazy so I don't have to do it myself.

QuestEon

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Re: The Promise and Failure of UPB
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2014, 10:00:14 PM »
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Great work, I'm new to this site and I'm extremely thankful for what you're doing here. I appreciate Molyneux's work at spreading libertarianism and he's a good explainer of other people's work, but his own podcasts always struck me as needlessly verbose, and morally unsettling, but I lack the time and energy to go through all that material solo to figure out just what this guy is up to.

I'm glad someone is out there digging through the crazy so I don't have to do it myself.


Ha! Thank you! I agree with you. He could have been an extraordinary teacher.

You might be interested in this one. I think it explains quite a lot:

Stefan Molyneux—the “Splitting” question
It isn't about winning the debate. It's about the truth.