Author Topic: How FDR stalled and obscured my self knowledge  (Read 12233 times)

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Kaz

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Re: How FDR stalled and obscured my self knowledge
« Reply #15 on: February 01, 2013, 05:23:59 AM »
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I'm really bothered by the psychiatric technique of labeling personalities.

Before I came to Stef, I had begun reading Thomas Szasz, who is known in the libertarian movement as leading opponent of mainstream psychiatry.

To sum his case in a few sentences, psychiatry is invalid because it defines metaphors as diseases. In medicine, a disease manifests itself in the form of an objective lesion upon the body that causes measurable dysfunction. Doctors 'define' psychiatric disorders in a subjective manner, based upon symptoms.

Stefanology shares the same issues of diagnoses via symptoms. The 'doctor' doesn't even need to inspect you or your life to diagnose what's wrong and what you need to do to repair your 'disease.'

Hi Bob,
I have read some of your horrible experiences and I offer my sympathy for what you needlessly suffered.

I do not condone what Stefanology does, I have been appalled by it from day one. 

Psychology does have it's use if it is applied properly.  Please refer to what I wrote above, especially the second last reply paragraph.  Also consider that it is the ability to see a pattern of behaviour and anticipate probable future actions based on our psychological knowledge that is a defence against predators, including those whose method is to abuse psychology.

One of my issues with the psychological establishment is that they have failed to educate the general public and protect people from the dangers of predatory personality disorders.  In some cases, they also have ridiculously taken at face value the word of narcissists, psychopaths, etc ie, people who by definition lie and unwittingly revictimize their victims.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2013, 10:36:26 AM by Kaz »
Just because you have left FDR, it doesn't mean that FDR has left you.

"Taking responsibility for something and self-blame are horses of two entirely different colors. The former is empowering; the latter is paralyzing." ~ John Rosemond, Ph.D

Kaz

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Re: How FDR stalled and obscured my self knowledge
« Reply #16 on: February 01, 2013, 10:15:13 AM »
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I discovered only after I left FDR that I have trouble with paranoia and narcissism, which FDR is almost designed to appeal to. I've known about the paranoia for a months now, but I came to the realization about narcissism only last night. This eventually led me to think about how these realizations were impossible at FDR.



Congratulations on becoming more aware.  It seems from your posting elsewhere atm that you are going through a bit of an epiphany atm.

Your post reminded me of the false cult personality QuestEon wrote about here.



« Last Edit: February 01, 2013, 10:38:13 AM by Kaz »
Just because you have left FDR, it doesn't mean that FDR has left you.

"Taking responsibility for something and self-blame are horses of two entirely different colors. The former is empowering; the latter is paralyzing." ~ John Rosemond, Ph.D

Anarchist

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Re: How FDR stalled and obscured my self knowledge
« Reply #17 on: February 01, 2013, 06:56:48 PM »
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Congratulations on becoming more aware.  It seems from your posting elsewhere atm that you are going through a bit of an epiphany atm.

Thanks :)

Your post reminded me of the false cult personality QuestEon wrote about here.

Yeah, that certainly seemed to be the case for me, particularly after I started taking on Stefan's ways of thinking about things. Perhaps that's a major cause of the effect.

Listener

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Re: How FDR stalled and obscured my self knowledge
« Reply #18 on: February 01, 2013, 09:28:57 PM »
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Anarchist,

Thank you for sharing.  It would be difficult to present my own experience with the Molyneux media empire in a plain, useful fashion, but I would just like to let you know:  I also became concerned that I might be a narcissist during the peak of my involvement with FDR, and during the few months afterwards.  Put simplistically, FDR had overstimulated my capacity for moral condemnation, of others and of myself (my "false" self... while I never fully bought into that concept, it's a pernicious metaphor).

Moderation in all things, even in self-criticism. 

Kaz

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Re: How FDR stalled and obscured my self knowledge
« Reply #19 on: February 25, 2013, 08:24:52 AM »
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Re Sam Vaknin:

I think that he is the Stefan Molyneux of Psychology.  They both have a lot in common.  He has also run abusively psychologising fora on the internet.

Sam Vaknin is not qualified.  He is a criminal who got caught in a pump and dump scheme and got sent to jail.  In jail, he claims that he was diagnosed with NPD.

He has no real qualifications or experience.  He bought his PhD on the internet. 

He has successfully passed himself off as an "expert" on NPD, which he is not.  To put his writing in context, it can be useful to read as a point of view of someone who supposedly has NPD.  His work is full of landmines and can be very misleading, even if they are insightful.  His work has none of the overall coherency of someone who has actually done the work or is original.  I get the impression that he has paraphrased other authors and mixed it in with his poisonous outlook on life.

Psychology has its uses and abuses, but it is unfair to judge it's value by it's charatans.  It is also unfair to give someone credit who has plagarised work others have done, sometimes disrespectfully so.

http://enpsychopedia.org/index.php/Sam_Vaknin

My opinion is that it is prudent to describe psychological concepts in english as much as possible.  A lot of people do not understand what you mean and there is a lot of confusion over what the concepts actually mean, not helped by self proclaimed experts (eg Molyneux, Vaknin) abusing them.  I think that dianostic summaries are a kind of shorthand only useful in certain specific contexts.  Also, it is possible that more than one or two clusters of personality traits can apply (comorbidity) to a person.

Edit: this website is dodgy.  The information is still valid in this case, please see post next page for clarification


I got fooled by teh internets! 

In googling for the information, I was so focused on what I was looking for, I failed to noticed where it came from.  Here is how I got fooled:

http://enpsychlopedia.org/
http://enpsychopedia.org/

Note the missing l, so it is enpsycho.  I have reason to believe that the site that I inadvertently linked to is anomymously owned by a cult much worse than FDR.  By much worse, I mean criminal activities and actively stalking people who may or have questioned their tactics.  I cannot reveal who I think they are because I do not have enough evidence.  The site, however is still dodgy because it is easy to mistake for an other, there is no link to affiliated organisations or any clue who is running the show.  Also, the content is cherry picked, very biased and probably exists as part of their internet stalking tactics.  These people are so sly and nasty, they pick fights with other people to abuse the court system for profit.

Isn't it interesting how some individuals and cults are all over psychology and psychopathology.  They are getting in first, setting themselves up as the experts when the content, undistorted by them applies to them!  They also are so prolific, spreading themselves all over the place, drowning out other voices.  Their basic tactics are all the same.  They are not interested in facilitating the spread of knowledge, only their distorted world view and they do not care who or what gets trampled on in doing so.  As such, they are responsible for the spread of disinformation, which is manipulative and ultimately enslaving.

They have not altered the page I linked to, as I have seen the information before, which is why I did not smell a rat.  Anyway, to get away from that bad source, here are some links which verify what I said in my post:

http://narcissism-support.blogspot.com.au/2009/03/sam-vakin-diagnosed-psychopath.html

http://www.angelfire.com/zine2/narcissism/malignant_narcissism.html

http://narc-attack.blogspot.com.au/2006/08/web-war.html

http://www.chameleongroup.org.uk/npd/index.html

Isn't it ironic, that in the process of alerting people to be suspicious of where they get their information, I inadvertently fail to do it myself! 
« Last Edit: February 25, 2013, 08:39:42 AM by Kaz »
Just because you have left FDR, it doesn't mean that FDR has left you.

"Taking responsibility for something and self-blame are horses of two entirely different colors. The former is empowering; the latter is paralyzing." ~ John Rosemond, Ph.D

Florian

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Re: How FDR stalled and obscured my self knowledge
« Reply #20 on: February 26, 2013, 03:52:54 AM »
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I think part of FDR's attraction is that some want it desperately to be true. A guy in Canada found the answer to political and psychological problems. These people have idealism which is used against them. This also explains imo why some of those turn their critical thinking off. The problem with a false ideology is that it makes many right claims. But the few ones that are wrong tend to be fatal.
Moly iz catnip for the purrletariat

QuestEon

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Re: How FDR stalled and obscured my self knowledge
« Reply #21 on: February 26, 2013, 05:13:04 PM »
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Re Sam Vaknin:

I think that he is the Stefan Molyneux of Psychology.  They both have a lot in common.  He has also run abusively psychologising fora on the internet.

Sam Vaknin is not qualified.  He is a criminal who got caught in a pump and dump scheme and got sent to jail.  In jail, he claims that he was diagnosed with NPD.
Not to derail this excellent conversation but for those who noted that I quoted Vaknin in my original "Splitting" article...

Conrad pointed out to me when I published an earlier version of that article that Vaknin was probably not the greatest source. However, I thought the one paragraph I quoted was a particularly eloquent explanation and after an actual psychology PhD had reviewed and blessed it, I felt OK to run with it, along with a disclaimer. FWIW...
It isn't about winning the debate. It's about the truth.

Kaz

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Re: How FDR stalled and obscured my self knowledge
« Reply #22 on: February 27, 2013, 10:10:10 PM »
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Re Sam Vaknin:

I think that he is the Stefan Molyneux of Psychology.  They both have a lot in common.  He has also run abusively psychologising fora on the internet.

Sam Vaknin is not qualified.  He is a criminal who got caught in a pump and dump scheme and got sent to jail.  In jail, he claims that he was diagnosed with NPD.
Not to derail this excellent conversation but for those who noted that I quoted Vaknin in my original "Splitting" article...

Conrad pointed out to me when I published an earlier version of that article that Vaknin was probably not the greatest source. However, I thought the one paragraph I quoted was a particularly eloquent explanation and after an actual psychology PhD had reviewed and blessed it, I felt OK to run with it, along with a disclaimer. FWIW...

I really enjoyed your "Splitting" article, even with Vaknin.  In that article, you cautioned readers that he was controversial but in this instance, his quote was consistent with your research.

I have no problem with the quoting of Vaknin in context.  He is very eloquent and when the quote unwittingly leaves the impression of him as an expert or when it could be tricky or deceptive that is when I share what I know. 

Personally, I think that Vaknin is a head f%@<er whose work and paranoid worldview is particularly insidious for vulnerable people and toxic for people who are dealing with the fallout after predatory relationships, especially where they are coming to terms with gaslighting or brainwashing.

Quote from: Vaknin I Psychopath
"You're body is flooded instantly with adrenaline and it's derivatives, like norenephrine. Now when these hormones pervade the bloodstream, you're brain reacts. It shuts down certain centers and activates others. This is called the stress reaction. Or stress syndrome action. Then when the abuse recedes, the adrenaline levels begin to drop. As they drop, the entire system goes into mayhem.

So what bullies usually do...they start and stop, start and stop. That achieves the maximal stress syndrome. And this is the great secret of bullying: never overdo it...small doses...the victim will do the rest."
Just because you have left FDR, it doesn't mean that FDR has left you.

"Taking responsibility for something and self-blame are horses of two entirely different colors. The former is empowering; the latter is paralyzing." ~ John Rosemond, Ph.D

Listener

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Re: How FDR stalled and obscured my self knowledge
« Reply #23 on: March 03, 2013, 03:16:03 AM »
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After I read Civilization and Its Discontents, I was left with this strong notion:  Sigmund Freud would have made a great novelist. 

He no doubt achieved uncommon insights into the human mind (or certain facets of it).  But were his theories falsifiable or supported by striking new empirical evidence?  No.  It wasn't much of anything, as science goes.

I see Sam Vaknin and Stefan Molyneux (I'm Facebook friends with both!) the same way.  They're intelligent men and their assertions about human nature are worth mulling over every now and then.  But they've left no body of research or otherwise rigorously justified hypotheses upon which to build.

Another person like this:   peak oil & global warming doomsayer James Howard Kunstler.  He has a distinctive, thorough, imaginative, and often appealing worldview.  He is, in fact, a novelist and a painter, so he's largely able to contain his insights to the realm of the humanities.  But when he wrote The Long Emergency, a nonfiction work filled with hard projections about the future of our economy and ecosystem, there were this many footnotes:  0.  Not worth quite so much.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2013, 03:18:32 AM by Listener »