Author Topic: Freedom Feens exposes more secrets of Stefan Molyneux’s “Inner Circle”  (Read 6620 times)

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Disillusioned

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I know QE said they'd post the podcast on the front page, but for those eager to listen in the mean time, here is a link to the interview: http://www.freedomfeens.com/2014/08/31/the-truth-about-stefan-molyneux-from-two-people-who-were-in-his-inner-circle-freedom-feens-live-radio-archive/
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QuestEon

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Re: Great interview with 2 former inner-circle members
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2014, 04:50:07 PM »
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Thank you! I'm still buzzing from the revelations in that one.

Hmm...maybe it is a cult.   :)
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QuestEon

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Hey gang--the article is on the front page. I summarized some of the more "wow" revelations to make it a quick read and convenient listen.

Freedom Feens exposes more secrets of Stefan Molyneux’s “Inner Circle”

It's not my way to suggest what people should do, but...sharing is caring!

Q.E.
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Mike_Lice

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Id would have liked to have heard their experiences with Christina. Christina is a psychologist and she should know better than to support Stefan's new age psychoanalyzing methods.

Disillusioned

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Hey gang--the article is on the front page. I summarized some of the more "wow" revelations to make it a quick read and convenient listen.

Freedom Feens exposes more secrets of Stefan Molyneux’s “Inner Circle”

It's not my way to suggest what people should do, but...sharing is caring!

Q.E.


Great article! One thing that stood out as possibly innacurate:

Quote
8:20—The inner circle attrition rate is pretty high. Yeah, people get fully dedicated to Molyneux but after two-to-three years nearly all of them leave in disgust, which is “common to cults.” (Both ex-members are very forthright about describing the fully committed part of FDR as a cult.)


I recall most inner-circle members sticking around for quite a bit longer than two-to-three years. It is true that nearly all have left, but most took significantly longer than that to reach a point of disgust with Molyneux. I don't think we know that all the members who have left are even disgusted with him.
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Argent

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Something the interview didn't touch on, that I'd love to hear them talk about if they do any more of these interviews: RTR.

During the time period that Colleen and Greg were active, RTR was possibly even more of a "thing" at FDR than defooing was. It was touted as an exhilarating experience that all the cool kids were doing. There was no higher end than being a participant in an RTR session with other FDR members--or with Stefan himself.

The keys to correct RTRing were being "open and honest" about your own feelings, while at the same time, not "managing" other people's feelings (i.e. don't be afraid to say something just because it might make someone else feel bad. Only they are in charge of their feelings and how they react to things).

Stefan would regale listeners with stories about how he and Christina used RTR to work through difficult problems, and how unbelievably blissful his marriage was as a result. Sometimes he'd bring Christina on to corroborate.

Because Stefan advertised RTR as THE key to personal happiness and relationship success (after you've defooed, of course), members at the time were eager to get some RTR practice in on each other. Colleen and Greg alluded to this in the call when they mentioned the constant Skype discussions between members. I don't pay as much attention anymore, but I think the calls are still going on today.

Personally, I think the RTR principles can be applied usefully in close personal relationships, but can go sadly awry when used between people who don't really know each other or have a history of commitment to help bring the relationship through difficult moments. You get oversharing between people who don't really know each other, and hurtful things being said in the name of "honesty," enabled by the belief that one should not have to "manage" other people's feelings. Not to mention that, since Stefan had a pretty good track record of converting people of any former interest into aspiring psychologists, people would use the calls as a chance to try out their new therapy skillz.

Before he came up with the Against Me idea, RTR was also the tool Stefan provided for proving the corruption of family members. If you RTRed your parents out of the blue and they didn't RTR back, this could be taken as proof that they were bad people and the relationship was beyond repair. Check out the beginning of the RTR book itself for more on this.

In short, there was a lot that went on at FDR that had nothing to do with philosophy or politics, and was (IMO) irresponsibly instigated by Stefan himself. He overemphasized the benefits of RTR without warning people about the potential consequences of improper application.

...

If there's time for a chapter IV, they could get into the advent of the "Mecosystem" and how Stefan used it to ignore aspects of his listeners' honesty that he didn't like ("that's your mother talking.") I don't think many people outside of the devoted listenership have heard of the Mecosystem, since it was never described in detail in public podcasts, and the Mecosystem podcasts were not even posted in the donator media sections... you had to donate and then email Stefan begging for access. He would throw around the word every now and again though, just to pique listeners' interest.

All of the color in this post is my own and would be difficult to provide references for... can anyone back me up?

Disillusioned

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Something the interview didn't touch on, that I'd love to hear them talk about if they do any more of these interviews: RTR.

During the time period that Colleen and Greg were active, RTR was possibly even more of a "thing" at FDR than defooing was. It was touted as an exhilarating experience that all the cool kids were doing. There was no higher end than being a participant in an RTR session with other FDR members--or with Stefan himself.

The keys to correct RTRing were being "open and honest" about your own feelings, while at the same time, not "managing" other people's feelings (i.e. don't be afraid to say something just because it might make someone else feel bad. Only they are in charge of their feelings and how they react to things).

Stefan would regale listeners with stories about how he and Christina used RTR to work through difficult problems, and how unbelievably blissful his marriage was as a result. Sometimes he'd bring Christina on to corroborate.

Because Stefan advertised RTR as THE key to personal happiness and relationship success (after you've defooed, of course), members at the time were eager to get some RTR practice in on each other. Colleen and Greg alluded to this in the call when they mentioned the constant Skype discussions between members. I don't pay as much attention anymore, but I think the calls are still going on today.

Personally, I think the RTR principles can be applied usefully in close personal relationships, but can go sadly awry when used between people who don't really know each other or have a history of commitment to help bring the relationship through difficult moments. You get oversharing between people who don't really know each other, and hurtful things being said in the name of "honesty," enabled by the belief that one should not have to "manage" other people's feelings. Not to mention that, since Stefan had a pretty good track record of converting people of any former interest into aspiring psychologists, people would use the calls as a chance to try out their new therapy skillz.

Before he came up with the Against Me idea, RTR was also the tool Stefan provided for proving the corruption of family members. If you RTRed your parents out of the blue and they didn't RTR back, this could be taken as proof that they were bad people and the relationship was beyond repair. Check out the beginning of the RTR book itself for more on this.

In short, there was a lot that went on at FDR that had nothing to do with philosophy or politics, and was (IMO) irresponsibly instigated by Stefan himself. He overemphasized the benefits of RTR without warning people about the potential consequences of improper application.

...

If there's time for a chapter IV, they could get into the advent of the "Mecosystem" and how Stefan used it to ignore aspects of his listeners' honesty that he didn't like ("that's your mother talking.") I don't think many people outside of the devoted listenership have heard of the Mecosystem, since it was never described in detail in public podcasts, and the Mecosystem podcasts were not even posted in the donator media sections... you had to donate and then email Stefan begging for access. He would throw around the word every now and again though, just to pique listeners' interest.

All of the color in this post is my own and would be difficult to provide references for... can anyone back me up?

I was a PK. I recall almost all of this, and I think it's worth getting into if given a chance again. The only thing I'm not sure about is I don't remember having to beg for mecosystem podcasts. I know they were definitely for donators, and you could be right about the email aspect. I just don't remember.
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Argent

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I was a PK. I recall almost all of this, and I think it's worth getting into if given a chance again. The only thing I'm not sure about is I don't remember having to beg for mecosystem podcasts. I know they were definitely for donators, and you could be right about the email aspect. I just don't remember.

I'm not sure how they were initially released or how they are available now, but there was definitely a long period of time when he would release them in emails to subscribers, a few times a year. If you wanted them sooner, or if you got left off the distribution list, you had to beg. I take it they were a big subscription draw for him, and he didn't want to make them too readily available. I THINK you also had to be a recurring subscriber, and not just a sporadic donator.

Here are two prime examples:

board.freedomainradio.com/topic/25430-subscriber-only-premium-podcasts-going-out-this-afternoon

board.freedomainradio.com/topic/22810-stefs-live-mecosystem-rtr   (bonus: this one shows MMD's first exposure to the Mecosystem!)

(I recommend copying the links and viewing them through here: https://www.zend2.com/)

Disillusioned

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I was a PK. I recall almost all of this, and I think it's worth getting into if given a chance again. The only thing I'm not sure about is I don't remember having to beg for mecosystem podcasts. I know they were definitely for donators, and you could be right about the email aspect. I just don't remember.

I'm not sure how they were initially released or how they are available now, but there was definitely a long period of time when he would release them in emails to subscribers, a few times a year. If you wanted them sooner, or if you got left off the distribution list, you had to beg. I take it they were a big subscription draw for him, and he didn't want to make them too readily available. I THINK you also had to be a recurring subscriber, and not just a sporadic donator.

Here are two prime examples:

board.freedomainradio.com/topic/25430-subscriber-only-premium-podcasts-going-out-this-afternoon

board.freedomainradio.com/topic/22810-stefs-live-mecosystem-rtr   (bonus: this one shows MMD's first exposure to the Mecosystem!)

(I recommend copying the links and viewing them through here: https://www.zend2.com/)

I see. That makes sense. I signed up for a PK subscription when I started donating, so I was probably just given access to them right away.
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QuestEon

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I was a PK. I recall almost all of this, and I think it's worth getting into if given a chance again. The only thing I'm not sure about is I don't remember having to beg for mecosystem podcasts. I know they were definitely for donators, and you could be right about the email aspect. I just don't remember.

I'm not sure how they were initially released or how they are available now, but there was definitely a long period of time when he would release them in emails to subscribers, a few times a year. If you wanted them sooner, or if you got left off the distribution list, you had to beg. I take it they were a big subscription draw for him, and he didn't want to make them too readily available. I THINK you also had to be a recurring subscriber, and not just a sporadic donator.

I think I have them squirreled away somewhere. There were three I think and I didn't listen to all of them. I vaguely remember that the first one seemed to me like another ramble with a click-bait title so I didn't finish it.

IIRC, this was another scandal-that-should-have-been-but-wasn't. I felt that Molyneux had stolen the entire idea of the Mecosystem from Internal Family Systems and was taking full credit for it. (Like he did with DROs, et. al.) One of his members, who actually read outside the group, found out about IFS and was so excited that Molyneux had "independently" come up with the same idea, another proof of his genius.

As the group began reading and talking more and more about IFS, Molyneux began talking less and less about the Mecosystem and finally quit altogether.

Pretty funny stuff.
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Argent

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Re: Freedom Feens exposes more secrets of Stefan Molyneux’s “Inner Circle”
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2014, 05:49:03 PM »
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At the time there was this air of mystique and awe around the conclusions Stefan drew using the mecosystem theory, the dream analysis, etc. Like, "Wow, how does Stef come up with such deep insights? He is so skilled and knowledgeable, and I have a lot of work to do if I want to get to that level."

Looking back at it now, it's pretty funny, because his "deep insights" always pointed to the exact same thing: your parents are to blame. The way he skillfully wound himself to this conclusion made it sound impressive, though. He would sometimes start a few seemingly disconnected threads, and then tie them all together with one master stroke. The fact that the "your parents are to blame" conclusion didn't always fit perfectly served to make it even more impressive that he had managed to reach that conclusion. It's funny how the human mind works.