But Feminists ARE Socialists with panties!

[ZetaMan]

Don't go blaming me for the inevitable. You can stop participating without making a scene over it. What are you really trying to acheive?

[Lee Li]

Part 1:

Since I wasn't clear, I will be: " Feminists in my eyes are nothing more than traumatized VAGINAS" is an example of misogynistic hate speech you wrote. Another one (not written by you) would be "I hope you get raped" is another one common to misogynists with Internet Courage. There are many examples as well of this kind of speech -- just read the way Stefan writes his review on the movie "Frozen" (titled: "The Truth About Frozen" or somesuch), publicly available on his forum. It is dripping with contempt. One particularly absurd gem was "this dull bovine woman". (He's calling the woman a dumb cow???)

But, those are only examples. I haven't the time nor the stomach to point out every instance, but if one needed help, one could poll members of that gender on how they feel about hearing such...descriptions. Reading over the thread again, I note that really the only hate speech per se is that one I listed in the 1st paragraph, but it certainly colored my overall impression. The stuff Omega and Zetaman have written is troubling, but they are entitled to their views.

Whatever frustration you may have, go ahead and speak your views, but don't resort to name calling (as is evident by my popping in, there are other people reading this!!). Logic and evidence stands above all else.

Part 2:

Since I gave a quick summary of Sapolsky's work, would you summarize Warren's?

[Omega]

Whatever frustration you may have, go ahead and speak your views, but don't resort to name calling (as is evident by my popping in, there are other people reading this!!). Logic and evidence stands above all else.

However I see that neither logic or evidence is allowed when talking about women, since you expect everyone to worship them like goddesses.

and if you enter word of men prepare to fight, because that's how men work we do not spare each other feelings and use whatever weapons we have to win If you cant handle name calling you cannot say anything about equality.

I believe that If woman is "dumb cow" she deserved to be called like that just as when man is "stupid goat" we say so. And considering that many women stay at home doing mundane chores they typically become dumb cows. They just have no time to improve themselves learn new things and advance.

This your desire of political correctness is  exactly what I hate about women.
There is a lot of name calling towards men but nobody cares.

[QuestEon]

Whatever frustration you may have, go ahead and speak your views, but don't resort to name calling (as is evident by my popping in, there are other people reading this!!). Logic and evidence stands above all else.

I have to echo Lee Li's point here.

What I see in this thread are mostly generalizations and "You believe that because you're a ____" (fill in the blank) type of arguments. (Argument from Personal Attack). It just doesn't seem to be a high-quality discussion.

[Prodigal son]

There is a lot of name calling towards men but nobody cares.

I certainly care about that, but why add the "towards men"? Name-calling and generalized shaming are not good practices irrespective of the target.

However I see that neither logic or evidence is allowed when talking about women, since you expect everyone to worship them like goddesses.

I see nothing of the kind. Where has Lee Li said he expects everyone to worship women like goddesses? I think that's a strawman applied to those of us who would insist on defending our sisters as well as our brothers. As for logic and evidence, those things have to be carefully presented. I don't think it's reasonable to assume that anyone who disagrees with me lacks logic and evidence period, although they might (like me) in some instances.

[Argent]

To me, a high-quality discussion looks like this:

• Relatively small number of posts in thread
• Medium to long average post length
• Few back-and-forth exchanges between a pair or trio of individuals
• Greater focus on the content posted than on the person who wrote the post. (Regardless of whether or not insults are used. Even friendly chat is likely not interesting to others reading the thread.)

In other words, the kind of thread a 3rd party can stumble across years later and still get a lot out of, because it is content-dense, and isn't bloated by pages of chat/squabbling between individuals.

Maybe we can boil it down to "If you don't have something good to say, don't say anything at all." "Good" doesn't mean "politically-correct" (whatever that is....), it means the post enhances the quality of the discussion rather than bloating it (as described above).

I think the best way to cut down on bloat is to not engage. A personal argument between strangers on a message board is not likely to lead anywhere productive. Let's all aim higher.

[Elucidated]

I echo the sentiments of Lee Li, QuestEon, Kaz & Argent above.

 I have been put off from engaging in any discussions here recently as I see too many personal attacks and insults rather than points addressed. On top of this, generalizations and opinions are being put forward as 'evidence' which makes for a very poor quality discussion.

[Omega]

I certainly care about that, but why add the "towards men"? Name-calling and generalized shaming are not good practices irrespective of the target.

so why do you brag only about hatred towards women but when women discus how all men must be castrated that gets no attention?
when women call men animals brutes etc that also seem to be fine.
Did you even listened to what famous feminists say and what insane hatred towards men they radiate?
You may claim that you are against disrespecting men but do you ever said anything in regards of that ?
why wont we discuss what feminists are talking on their lectures for a change.

Of course I agree that here we should not use personal attack tactic, but claims towards group is not personal attack.

I see nothing of the kind. Where has Lee Li said he expects everyone to worship women like goddesses? I think that's a strawman applied to those of us who would insist on defending our sisters as well as our brothers. As for logic and evidence, those things have to be carefully presented. I don't think it's reasonable to assume that anyone who disagrees with me lacks logic and evidence period, although they might (like me) in some instances.

So how do you explain that aggression towards anyone who dares to say anything bad about women?
Lack of logic is when instead of argument you make accusations about hatred or insensitivity.
Disagreement is completely expected and even required for discussion to take place, if you agree on everything, there is no discussion.

[Omega]

To me, a high-quality discussion looks like this:

And unfortunately there are no discussions like that.
this forum is lacking discussion at all, it is just same as FDR where everyone is supposed to comfort everyone and attack those who have different opinion.

[BicameralMilieu]

This thread has jumped the shark...

[Prodigal son]

To me, a high-quality discussion looks like this:
...

I think you're generally right, but it sounds prescriptive and I'm wary of guidelines.
Anyway, I enjoy shorts and one-liners too. Some of those long ones are, well, long (mine especially - I am constitutionally long-winded - my wife once accused me of psychological violence due to talking too much).
I also enjoy threads like this, which although it is guilty of just about everything you could throw at it and more besides, is actually compelling and a bit challenging. I think posters able to rile up a thread or a forum a little are actually doing a good job. Any sort of scandal's always worth a read in my book... even a raised eyebrow gives me a chuckle.

[Prodigal son]

this forum is lacking discussion at all, it is just same as FDR where everyone is supposed to comfort everyone and attack those who have different opinion.

Oh come come Omega, it's like herding cats with you. What kind of relationship did you have with your parents as a child? (just joking). There is a fairly high level of consensus on the forum because we know rather a lot about our subject matter and we have gone a fair distance in establishing some basic truths in relation to it. Posting confrontationally on a forum that one has only just joined is sometimes called trolling and will elicit hostility wherever you go. I would treat you just the same if you were to come into my house and complain about the colour of the curtains right off the bat.
That the forum lacks discussion is no more than your opinion. I think it has plenty of discussion thanks, as I have acknowledged above, also to confrontational posters like you... however long your tenure (he added, darkly). I like chillout, you like jazz, end of. I said it before and I'll say it again, you are one-sided sir, you lack your alpha... and interestingly, another challenging poster on this thread alone is also a Greek letter - the sixth, although in the English language it occupies the same role as yours, at the very tail end of the alphabet. Is there a meaning concealed in that apparent coincidence, I wonder?

[Argent]

To me, a high-quality discussion looks like this:
...

I think you're generally right, but it sounds prescriptive and I'm wary of guidelines.
Anyway, I enjoy shorts and one-liners too. Some of those long ones are, well, long (mine especially - I am constitutionally long-winded - my wife once accused me of psychological violence due to talking too much).
I also enjoy threads like this, which although it is guilty of just about everything you could throw at it and more besides, is actually compelling and a bit challenging. I think posters able to rile up a thread or a forum a little are actually doing a good job. Any sort of scandal's always worth a read in my book... even a raised eyebrow gives me a chuckle.

People say that to me a lot about prescription. I think it's partially how I word things. I'm not suggesting we establish such strict rules that people are afraid to speak, but I don't see a problem with laying out a vision for the quality of discussion we want to find here, and then attempting to adhere to it.

If I want a stream of mostly throwaway comments to keep me occupied at all hours, I go to reddit, etc. When I come here, I'm looking for something a little more timeless. That said, provocative is ok in my book! But there's a difference between provocative and squabble that looks like it's been dragged into 2 or 3 different threads simultaneously, based more on the commenters' desire to argue with each other than on the original intent of the thread.

[Prodigal son]

People say that to me a lot about prescription.

Don't get me started on that one! Fortunately for my compatriots I live alone, but when anyone has the misfortune to encounter me on my home turf I get out my rulebook right off the bat and start telling them this and that and wotnot (eat this, like that, question the other, enjoy this movie, interpret it like this, retire at this time...) - I think that's probably why I'm sensitive to the issue!

[Omega]

just the same if you were to come into my house and complain about the colour of the curtains right off the bat.

Nobody is complaining about anything of that sort, neither I try to be extremely provocative.
I always try to stay on topic and not to derail threads. but this thread is about feminism where my opinion somewhat similar to what thread author says so I guess it was completely legitimate to express my opinion.
All complains we have here is about lack of political correctness and supposed hatred towards women that come from people who do not even participate in discussion.

Is there a meaning concealed in that apparent coincidence, I wonder?

No there is no meaning, his letter comes from MGTOW therminology mine just random.
But is we apply same logic I am just farther in the end.
So since zeta male is one who stays away from gender roles. I just go further and stay away from society entirely, just observing it without any desire to participate.